tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post1995182187162923116..comments2024-03-29T00:16:25.097-07:00Comments on The Eponymous Flower: Pope Has Interest in Resolving SSPX SituationTancredhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16015531337154301560noreply@blogger.comBlogger62125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-52424713466598203712014-05-13T18:57:52.130-07:002014-05-13T18:57:52.130-07:00The conciliar church has called for a new evangeli...The conciliar church has called for a new evangelization because it is a new faith. A new form of worship, a new daily prayer of the church, a new calendar, new doctrines for those outside the church, lay ministers, a new understanding of the papacy, built in the principles of immanence and modernism, new rites of ordination, new names and prayers for the sacraments, new buildings, new positions in parishes...you need a new evangelization to spread this new 'good news'.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-36202022746424929812014-05-13T18:26:03.695-07:002014-05-13T18:26:03.695-07:00We’ve been this way before my friend. The same ha...We’ve been this way before my friend. The same happened with Good Shepherd, Campos and Papa Stronsay.Tancredhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16015531337154301560noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-37256551573684980572014-05-13T17:03:35.914-07:002014-05-13T17:03:35.914-07:00The SSPX has also countered Rorate's "exc...The SSPX has also countered Rorate's "exclusive" regarding Bishop Fellay's two assistants, Frs. Niklaus Pfluger and Alain-Marc Nély, having attended a Mass offered by the Pope. Apparently that never happened either.Elizabethhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08481730297658525937noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-31868279707700474832014-05-12T20:45:12.842-07:002014-05-12T20:45:12.842-07:00Sometimes, people forget or don't want to unde...Sometimes, people forget or don't want to understand that charity involves telling people the ugly truth. And this involves making enemies of bishops and powerful people. <br /><br />That's why the SSPX is hated and are not invited. But for the part of the SSPX, I have not seen my local chapel reach out to the nearby parish. (In fact it would be a wonderful test of the "tolerant", "welcoming", "charitable" and "non-judgemental" Novus Ordo parish to see if they would allow SSPX in like they would Jesus Christ, or if they would only allow some other counterfeit "Jesus" that they find more agreeable. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-83841235972905058812014-05-12T18:13:14.340-07:002014-05-12T18:13:14.340-07:00Logically, the Catholic Church is the Truth, or it...Logically, the Catholic Church is the Truth, or it isn't, because there is only but one Truth, all others are derivatives or counterfeits. <br /><br />And this overlaps with the notion that we have to consider Jesus Christ as either a liar, or a crazy person if He is not who He says He Is. That Jesus Christ is not just a "Great Moral Teacher" (Meaning He is a crazy person or a liar) but the fount of all the splendor and beauty that is expressed in the Mass. <br /><br />Yes, I am not an SSPX supporter, but I wish they become the antidote to a poisoned and deceived people- and this means they have to do counter-revolutionary activities in infiltrating branches of society the same way the godless have done. Now, the neo-catholics and the Vatican 2 Liberals say "Well, how can we infiltrate using a visibly and identifiably Roman liturgy and spirituality which is what the SSPX demonstrates?" The problem that those modernists' methods present is that the supposedly Catholic clergy and religious had "Gone Native" and are as every bit as godless as Richard Dawkins. They had lost the gift of Faith that God gave them, and are now nothing more than social workers, politicians and bureaucrats in robes and miters. <br /><br />Traditionalists and the SSPX seem to offer a harder, and therefore Christlike and legitimate path to contributing to the Lord's mission entrusted to His Apostolic Church. Not so much heterodoxy for the sake of "orthodoxy." which we find nowadays. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-81790620758266859772014-05-12T18:00:02.812-07:002014-05-12T18:00:02.812-07:00It certainly concerns me too.It certainly concerns me too.ATnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-2220534848704228172014-05-12T13:28:18.882-07:002014-05-12T13:28:18.882-07:00There must be some reason they’re still meeting wi...There must be some reason they’re still meeting with Ecclesia Dei, and Msgr. Pozzo, but it is what it is.Tancredhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16015531337154301560noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-47876234590395020732014-05-12T13:26:49.426-07:002014-05-12T13:26:49.426-07:00That is correct. No official meeting took place. ...That is correct. No official meeting took place. It was what the Society said, a cordial meeting with a Vatican official during which at some point the Pope was introduced to the members of the Society who were present.<br /><br />This information was known for several weeks but was not publicized for the very simple reason that no one wanted to raise any false hopes about anything and, in any case, there really wasn't that much to report to begin with. The only thing that is significant is that the communication lines are still open, and so we must ask the Risen Savior to move the hardened Roman hearts in this matter.schmenznoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-25407270673119596942014-05-12T11:04:58.681-07:002014-05-12T11:04:58.681-07:00Brings back memories of what happened not only wit...Brings back memories of what happened not only with Good Shepherd but with Papa Stronsay as well. Same denunciations of the revelations of premature to actual reconciliation.<br /><br /> Tancredhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16015531337154301560noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-84922871564554596862014-05-12T10:51:01.497-07:002014-05-12T10:51:01.497-07:00I just read the same thing, direct from SSPX. No ...I just read the same thing, direct from SSPX. No such meeting occurred, brief or otherwise. Oops.Elizabethhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08481730297658525937noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-13627955460198857582014-05-12T09:25:19.528-07:002014-05-12T09:25:19.528-07:00That’s basically how Tornielli described it, with ...That’s basically how Tornielli described it, with his usual editorial hostility to the Society included.Tancredhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16015531337154301560noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-83555891462180229682014-05-12T09:21:09.504-07:002014-05-12T09:21:09.504-07:00HERE is the truth about the big "meeting"...HERE is the truth about the big "meeting" as reported by Rorate Coeli. http://sspx.org/en/news-events/news/about-meeting-pope-francis-and-bishop-fellay-4067<br /><br />Maybe Adfero should change his name to Interfero or Inferio and find himself a new source for his gossip.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-90400066870116883252014-05-12T08:29:31.035-07:002014-05-12T08:29:31.035-07:00Tancred,
Doesn't it concern you that Rorate h...Tancred,<br /><br />Doesn't it concern you that Rorate has linked to a Vatican Insider article? After all, Tornielli was complicit in the initial persecution of FFI, and as such he is not to be trusted when it comes to anything traditional. I suppose that you will remove this post. Denisenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-42873261505216909062014-05-12T05:40:57.985-07:002014-05-12T05:40:57.985-07:00Dear Tancred.
I'm sure they do. I don't d...Dear Tancred.<br />I'm sure they do. I don't doubt that at all. I'm sure they are wonderful, blessed priests who witness to the Lord Jesus every day. But, I've been to a 'Day of Recollection' given by an invited FSSP priest, advertised on the diocesan website, at a NO parish, but have as yet to see the SSPX do the same. This is what I mean. Honestly, I don't know if SSPX are being invited to do retreats/give homilies at NO parishes. Perhaps they are going to NO parishes, I don't know. But if would be lovely if they were. I wonder if an SSPX priest would even give the homily at a NO Mass? Why not? You've got to start somewhere. If they did give a homily, then a lot of NO parishioners would just see that they are good priests. 'Myths' would be dispelled. And SSPX Father could diplomatically go to coffee after Mass and circulate... I'm just saying. A lot of diocesan priests just call the SSPX schismatic like they're repeating a mantra. Even mentioning the word 'SSPX' is loaded, whereas all that has to be mentioned is that the Vatican has said they're not in schism and the Econe Four had their excommunications lifted (where that leaves the validity of Faculties and licitness, I'm not sure).<br /><br />I just think there needs to be a lot of love and charity on both sides really, then we can all benefit.Damask Rosehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12903564104733536123noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-75490052031655124942014-05-12T05:07:49.327-07:002014-05-12T05:07:49.327-07:00Society priests work like dogs to bring the Cathol...Society priests work like dogs to bring the Catholic Faith to the people of the world.Tancredhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16015531337154301560noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-60749784996351397502014-05-12T05:05:44.355-07:002014-05-12T05:05:44.355-07:00Who cares if you're SSPX, Jesuit or Dominican....Who cares if you're SSPX, Jesuit or Dominican. Do you accept the truths of the Catholic Faith outside of which no one at all, can be saved?Tancredhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16015531337154301560noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-69828643867883322692014-05-12T05:02:20.763-07:002014-05-12T05:02:20.763-07:00Actually, if you read it, he goes to great lengths...Actually, if you read it, he goes to great lengths to show that the meeting doesn't mean anything.Tancredhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16015531337154301560noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-13160075655390505982014-05-12T05:01:01.437-07:002014-05-12T05:01:01.437-07:00I don't think the Archishop was any less eager...I don't think the Archishop was any less eager than Bishop Fellay to recognize the visible Church, far more so than these "Resistance" types are willing to admit. Their revisionism of the Archbishop is one of the conceits that permits them to pursue an agenda which causes some confusion and enmity among Catholics.Tancredhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16015531337154301560noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-80011051061833362752014-05-12T04:23:42.427-07:002014-05-12T04:23:42.427-07:00"Pope Has Interest in Resolving SSPX Situatio..."Pope Has Interest in Resolving SSPX Situation"<br /><br />I'll believe it when I see it. At the moment it just seems like gossip picked up in a hotel lobby.<br /><br />I agree with most commenters here regarding the SSPX. I do wish they were "in", no matter the fears and worries of "Volpi-ism". They could do a lot of good for all of us. Their priests could be invited to diocesan parishes for a "Day of Recollection"/Day Retreats. They could do retreats/Latin/TLM courses for diocesan priests and our NO kids could go on their summer camps. That would be brilliant for our kids, a real injection of faith, and I do trust the SSPX priests and sisters. But it wouldn't work if NO kids on theses camps get bullied because they go to the NO Mass. SSPX priests need to be more accessible. It's no good a SSPX priest coming to a parish and then give a talk on the evils of VII and the NO Mass and rambling on about how his host priest's ordination isn't valid. Some women don't want to wear a mantilla. They need to be diplomatic. As SSPXers have been brought up in the SSPX, SSPX priests need to understand that NO-goers have been brought up in their milieu too (...'brought up' with almost nothing!) and went along with the initial changes due to obedience. It's not their fault. SSPX priests need to be charitable, kind and more loving towards people. In some respects, being an SSPX, FSSP or any priest in "Ecclesia Dei" is, not sure I should say it, an easy type of priesthood. Parishioners are guaranteed, want to be there, believe what the priest says and support the priest emotionally and practically. Not so with the NO priest. An orthodox NO priest may have a hard time in his parish. I think there is a type of on-going circular partisanship in the SSPX between priest and parishioner. This being illustrated by the homilies/talks/letters to "benefactors" on a certain theme. If the SSPX were a member of Ecclesia Dei, this type of thing would be culled and make for a healthier SSPX. For some SSPXers, the partisanship may be the only reason they put money in the collection plate and SSPX priests shouldn't have to feel obliged to cultivate this. This of course, could mean a little more poverty for the SSPX Fathers and Society projects.<br /><br />OK, so the SSPX are unhappy with the VII Church/Rome, but the VII Church/Rome has called for a New Evangelisation. What are the SSPX doing to evangelise the rest of us? At the moment it feels like they're just looking after themselves.<br /><br />LeonG, I agree with mostly everything you say except this:<br /><br />"...the NO - impossible to a real traditional because we know it is not valid."<br /><br />Damask Rosehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12903564104733536123noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-46948774091230678702014-05-12T01:25:29.654-07:002014-05-12T01:25:29.654-07:00Because "others" are dominated by the pr...Because "others" are dominated by the propagandist mainstream media, including the liberal modernist neo-catholic one, They see only superficialities and what they want to see. The new regime in Rome wanted to produce a generation of semi-literate and illiterate relativist newchurchers who will accept whatever they are told - yes, even to believe that you can conanise "saints" without miracles and in a rush; you can have protestant liturgy and still be Catholic; you can dress and live how you like and go to Communion; you can ecumenise & be involved in eclectic praxis as far as you wish and remain in The Faith; you cannot be completely traditional and still be in "full communion" with Rome; if you are in "full communion with Rome" you are allowed to get away with almost anything as long as you are not exposed publicly etc.<br /><br />If you are SSPX, even though there are official statements to the contrary by the last pope and other key cardinals such as Castrillon-Hoyos, you are schismatic, heretical, sectarian, integriste, far-right extremist, rightist nutter, taliban or any other insulting name they can imagine.<br /><br />LeonGhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02778834856947933957noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-68976513314858629492014-05-12T01:11:07.393-07:002014-05-12T01:11:07.393-07:00At base, Archbishop Lefebvre wanted to hand down T...At base, Archbishop Lefebvre wanted to hand down The Faith as it was handed down to him not a liberal modernist replica stripped of everything that embodied Roman Catholic Faith. He was attached to The Faith of Eternal Rome not the Liberal Modernist Rome of the counterfeiters.LeonGhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02778834856947933957noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-20002167564232038762014-05-12T00:43:09.237-07:002014-05-12T00:43:09.237-07:00So much for that giant tent by the Pope.
Did you ...So much for that giant tent by the Pope.<br /><br />Did you know that orders had been fighting each other since the days of St. Francis? Dominicans, Jesuits, Franciscans, Augustinians, etc. Had been at each others' throats but the only thing that kept them Catholic is the Pope. <br /><br />It's a good thing the SSPX isn't sedevacantist. <br /><br />But what of the Pope? If the popes, since whichever post-war Pope is a modernist, then they are a heretic. Frankly, you'd be more honest if you support a "Traditionalist Anti-Pope" and attack Rome and install your own. <br /><br />Whatever. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-45799552451325779512014-05-12T00:38:18.447-07:002014-05-12T00:38:18.447-07:00You would have to forgive me for how superficial m...You would have to forgive me for how superficial my knowledge of SSPX is, but all I know is that they're painted very poorly by people responsible for disseminating information into the whole Catholic Church. I know there's more to it than the SSPX being "A Rebel Schismatic Group" but for SSPX to succeed, what I am saying, is that it has to understand that not everyone outside the society, people who were made to believe that the Novus Ordo is all there is, and all the post Vat.2 nonsense is all there is, have the patience, intelligence, or charity to even listen to an SSPX apologist. What can people do in an age of information when there's so much, and some conflicting and confusing? <br /><br />What happens when SSPX is painted poorly by organizations trusted at face value because it has semblance of "Officiality"? If I were a supporter of the SSPX, even though I know their situation, I'd seem like a crazy person and people aren't likely to listen to what I'd have to say. <br /><br />So that's the dilemma for us non-SSPX supporters but sympathize out of their intentions of preserving the Roman Catholic patrimony. Some of you have the luxury of having a group that already agrees with you, the rest of us perform a balancing act.<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-44893299946870552782014-05-11T20:13:15.157-07:002014-05-11T20:13:15.157-07:00Considering how hard the Sodano clan fought agains...Considering how hard the Sodano clan fought against the regularization of the Society, I think it’s entirely possible there are other motives.<br /><br />If the Society doesn’t like it, they can just consecrate 8 more Bishops. Game over, at least for this decade.Tancredhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16015531337154301560noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4404498638452030181.post-70175952865142158142014-05-11T20:11:24.540-07:002014-05-11T20:11:24.540-07:00His primary concern was Liturgical and he changed ...His primary concern was Liturgical and he changed his own opinion many times on the Council and other issues. Who can blame him, but someone will no doubt try.<br /><br />http://www.traditioninaction.org/HotTopics/f050ht_LefebvreCCL.htmTancredhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16015531337154301560noreply@blogger.com